Cait
Hil Hello, and welcome to today’s episode of The Born to Rise podcast. You guys I have missed you. All right, I’m just gonna let you know that we are doing some pretty freakin amazing stuff over here. In my little corner of the world, there is a brand new version of this podcast that is happening getting worked on behind the scenes. But I am coming out of hibernation because our guest today, Shoshana Raven, and I have something so exciting to share with you. We have just a beautiful conversation. If you listen to this podcast, you know that I had shows on the podcast in 2021. I worked with Shoshana for 18 months when she scaled her business from multiple six figures to multiple seven figures. I was with her through that journey through I think you know like being at 300,000 or 350,000 to 2 million in her business. We walked together during that time. And so in this episode, you can hear so much growth and evolution in both of our journeys as mentors and we riff on so many important topics about leadership and growth and evolution and what it actually means to be a mentor. So tune into this episode. I hope you absolutely love it. And go ahead and do me a favor guys. If you listen to this send me a DM and let me know your biggest takeaway you can tag both shows and myself. And I hope that you enjoy this episode. Hello beautiful humans and welcome to today’s very special episode of The borns arise podcast so you guys may or may not know that we are currently on a break with this podcast. However, we are coming out of hiding for this very special episode with a woman who I absolutely love and adore a former client a dear friend and an absolute way paver in this industry and beyond Shosh it is so beautiful to be here with you today. Welcome, love.

Shoshanna
Oh my gosh, I’m gonna cry. Seriously, I am so happy Cait to see you. And, you know, we had our first podcast episode together on this podcast like a year plus ago. And I’m just so excited to see what comes through this time around. I’m just super it just being in Your presence is like overwhelming for me, because I love you so much. I’m so appreciative for you. And yeah, I’m just excited to meet all the all the humans today.

Cait
It’s so good. It’s so good shows. And it’s you know, it’s so funny. We were talking before we started recording of just like yeah, our journey together. But also like, you know, this touch point of our relationship and the journeys that both of us have been on, you know you in like unraveling from an old relationship like, and, and all of that like being in that relationship and then leaving that relationship and then leading yourself through that, like breakup and transition and like having your heart cracked open, and all of the newness that came in. And then there’s just like, rocket ship of success and expansion in your business and meeting your new partner traveling the world, you know, in all of this and being in your new house, and just all of this amazing growth and momentum and like the fact that I was not a mom when we met and now I have two freaking humans that have come into the world through my vagina and like call me mom. And it’s just like,

Shoshanna
I know when I think about, you know, the first time that I saw Cait Scudder commented on my posts, or whatever it was, I was like, Oh, my gosh, you know, you were just like, you were doing it. And for me, it was just so inspiring. Like, we had our first call and I was still like, little baby coach, and I was like, Oh my gosh, like, this feels like such a stretch and like even just thinking about who we were in our first conversations and, you know, joining rise and being with you for a year and a half and our mentorship and you honestly birthing to humans, like it’s it’s impressive when your mentor can like lead themselves through things and just create what you desire to create, but I’m like, no, no I was telling my partner earlier like, yes, Cait is like, so expansive and like doing amazing things, but I don’t think you understand like she she also birth to humans into this world. He’s like, that’s crazy. Like since I met her, she’s accomplished all of this has inspired me as helped me through, you know, some of my greatest growth spurts while being a new mom like this is, this is superhuman stuff.

Shoshanna
Crazy. Yeah, it is amazing. And we are and it’s yes, it’s so beautiful. First of all, thank you for that and I so feel you it’s like, I’m so I feel like we need to do if you desire to have kids, I feel like we need to do another episode when you become a mom. And that’s going to be fuckin interesting as hell but it’s like I remember when I had ln coming back from the hospital and just being like, why do we not have like a parade for mothers that just lasts all day every day? Because it is it it’s like such a it’s such a thing. So I really appreciate that reflection from you of like, all the things that we create in the context of whether it’s motherhood or whatever else it is that we have going on, and you know, shows there’s like 1,000,001 things, I feel like this whole episode can be just like the things that we love and appreciate about each other. I know. Like, what else are we gonna know truly, this could be like a whole podcast in and of itself, like not an episode like its own show. But I feel like one of the things that I want to just like highlight and say is that I feel you know, one of the themes that has been arising for me a lot lately in conversations and like my inner circle mastermind and just like with other super just sophisticated and powerful women is like power knows power. And there are so many ways in the coaching industry in like feminine leadership in general that I think that we can fall into, like a kind of a distorted either like being threatened by or being, you know, writing a negative story about because we sense like someone’s power, and we’re like, somehow bought into the lie of like, her being in her fullest expression somehow means that there’s not enough room for me. And one of the things that I feel like it’s such a clean frequency and a clean energetic between you and I that has been there from the very beginning of our relationship. And even now, you know, if that we’re not in like a mentorship relationship, but just like, true sisters supporting each other’s rise is like this knowing of like you in your power, and in your fullest expression is just like elevates the collective.

Shoshanna
Yeah, absolutely. And when we can give our mentors Grace like that, and just know, like, you don’t have to be above me. And I think it goes back to childhood. And the way we were brought up, like some people are really drawn to relationships and false dynamics that we’re perceiving in which someone’s like positioning themselves above you. And it’s like, more comfortable to be like, Okay, you’re kind of talking down to me, or, you know, you’re positioning yourself, like you have something I don’t have. And then I enter this relationship, and it can re traumatize people. But that’s something that like, plays out again, and again and again. And to know, like, we’re all equal power, and like, I would hire you again, you know, I’m like, I don’t care, like where we are in life, like what age we are helping the businesses are like, we just, we all have a unique, something to bring to the table. And you can just sense like, yes, if someone’s built, what you desire to build and the way you desire to build it. But I think we get to a certain level as well, that we’re not looking for someone with all the answers. And I think a lot of people are stuck serving a clientele that has no idea what they’re doing and is like, you have all the answers. And I can only choose one and I choose you. And that’s okay. I think a lot of people are desiring to expand out of that. But in order to do that, we have to do that, for ourselves, like to get to a level of growth and success, where you understand like, oh, I want to bulk up with like, you know, I would I would hire my friends in a heartbeat. Like so many of my clients are so specialized in what they offer. I’ve hired them so many times, and I would refer them out like, in a heartbeat. I would, I would trust them, whether that’s in the motherhood space, the grief space, you know, whether that’s like niche marketing support, or whatever it is, like, I get really excited when my clients start working with each other. Because I see that like, I’m really leading leaders. And that’s the point, right? I’m a leader, I’m working with another leader and you’re going to activate something within me, you know, and I learned from my own clients at that point.

Cait
So good, and I feel like this whole I mean, yes to everything that you’re saying. And I feel like this is such an important conversation in the space of leadership of what it actually like really bringing into awareness the way in which old paradigm even like subliminally sort of plays itself out this like antiquated idea of hierarchy based on whatever it is yours in business revenue, you know, this particular life status like married, not married mother, not mother, like, all of that just gets to dissolve and we get to connect from the knowing of like, Hey, what is the medicine that you are stewarding? What is the frequency that you are carrying? What are the codes that not you and you alone possess? And I must go through you in order to get them but like what is coming through you right now? And is there something in me that desires to get close to that to support me in my journey of expansion? And I feel like that is such a, such a refreshing and needed way of understanding who we choose to walk with in our journey of growth.

Shoshanna
Yeah, and, you know, it’s so easy. I think a lot of the times to discount whether it’s partners or friends or mentors, it’s like, always looking for but can I really learn from them? Are they really right for me? Because Because because, you know, I had someone write on a post of mine from 2017, or 2018. She was like, I scrolled all the way back, because part of me was like, Can I really learn from someone this young, and she was, like, you’ve always been magical. And it was crazy for me, because this was before I had my coaching business. And I was writing about the power of like, being silly, and how being silly and playful doesn’t discount, you know, your motivation, or your responsibility or your compassion, and why I bring that into my life and how it feels and why it confuses people and sometimes brings up insecurity within me, just like the same stuff I talk about now.

Cait
Totally, I’m like, on brand before you even had a brand.

Shoshanna
Yeah, but like seeing that she wrote, you know, I was questioning whether I could learn from someone so Young, it’s like our mind sometimes looks for all the reasons like kind of, to, to not connect, I think connection is at the core of it. And really like authentic connection and just knowing and having grace for people like what is for me here, I think that’s one of the most beautiful qualities we can cultivate as a leader was like really giving people the benefit of the doubt giving people grace. And also just seeing everyone like is a God, God goddesses, like kings, queens, you know, like, really, when you start looking at your partner like that, and I know you’ve used that languaging it’s like really strong to like, call your partner like a king and your queen and to look at, you know, potential clients like this. And really just, you know, your clients are coming to you for guidance and for support and your community is doing so. And sometimes I think for people, they start to look at people in a disempowered way. Yes. And when would you percent, you know, and it’s, it’s like, I saw some of my clients up on stage last night, they co authored a book, and oh, it’s so cool to be on that receiving end, like, oh, my gosh, I’m taking notes, this is brilliant. Like, and to be able to hold each other in their highest and also hold space for like the full human that comes to the table. I think any rejection of the human parts of people is just a mirror into what we reject within ourselves. Because the only reason we see it and others is because we’ve also experienced it interesting, so curious, and like loving, loving to all people that like, where am I looking for reasons not to learn from this person not to like this person to discount, you know, any kinds of celebration or wins or expression that they have. And it’s just a mirror of I do that to myself?

Cait
Totally, or how it’s like, it’s it’s like, I mean, there’s so many different ways to think about it a light that’s like shining so bright, that it’s hard to look at, or like that person is somehow representing something that somewhere on a conscious or unconscious level, I don’t actually think is available for me and like what a beautiful and that’s, that’s neutral, right? That’s not good. That’s not bad. But it’s information. And I feel like if we use that, to look at a new part of ourselves, there’s something so powerful that can emerge.

Shoshanna
Yeah, and it’s so an energetic mindset game. Like, at the end of the day, you know, how you wake up and how you have gratitude for your life and how you see the opportunities that have now you see other people like, it’s so easy. I feel like this with team I feel like this with mentors, with clients with anyone in our life. Like once something happens, that you don’t really like or that you perceive as a negative. It’s so easy to come up with all the reasons they’re doing something wrong. They’re not meeting up to your standards. The reasons you don’t like this person, like when you’re about to meet someone new you might even realize you’re already geared up to not like them. Yeah, and if we can just say like, what are all the reasons like I absolutely love this person that this person so like me are all the things that are different. Like I remember when we first started working together, being like so enthralled by your mother energy and like you are embarking on this motherhood journey. I’m like, This is so cool. Well, like, I just want to learn more about this, even though I wasn’t at that place in my life right now. Like, let me find all the reasons just to be like, Whoa, what can I learn? How can I love this person? And of course, we all get off track. And I think that’s why it’s important to realize like, it’s you. It’s never anyone else if you could have a different relationship with someone, but they haven’t changed, but it’s like you follow on follow? You feel like they’re amazing. Or like, Yeah, girl. Yeah. And then you’re like, Who are you to do this? Why is it all about the money one day, it’s like, the mirror have not changed. Change? And like, where are you finding reasons, you know, to project maybe like insecurities, fears, things you’re going through, because it’s so painful sometimes to look at, you know, where we’re not in radical personal ownership, responsibility, and really looking at our lives. With that view of anything is possible. Let me see the good, let me have gratitude for today, let me like live in a reality distortion field, where like, my dreams beyond my dreams are possible and that we all get to rise together. When I’m out of funk with that. That’s when my view of other people in the world starts to shift. And I’m like, oh, it’s not them. It’s not the world. It’s a me thing. And that’s that journey of like, really leading ourselves first, before we can lead others may think so many people are like, how do I lead really powerful leaders, and they want to know, some content hacker marketing hack, or, you know, sales strategy that’s going to be most attractive to them. And it’s like, you’ve, you’ve just got to lead yourself, and go through the kinds of things and have the kind of conversations with yourself and then online, that high level clients want to learn from, like, you’ve got to become it, you’ve got to walk yourself through it. You’ve got it. People know, there’s a match, like, yes, they really pay. And I don’t know, like you’re kind of worried about this month, and we all have worries, but it’s like, that’s not going to be a match to someone who’s like, I’m looking for a strong person who’s going to hold me and the kinds of like, totally happening in my life right now.

Cait
Yeah, we want that we want it not just to see but to actually feel that person’s capacity to like, not just like walk with them as the client through a challenging season or through highs, lows, everything in between, right, but like actually, through, walk with themselves enough, and hold themselves enough to be with whatever arises because it’s that capacity that actually sustains like the big growth, it sustains the dips and everything in between. And I just love shows that you’re talking about the necessity of the inner game first, and like taking really radical responsibility over any projections, noticing any, like stories that might start to creep in. And I think it’s so easy to do this, both about other people that we see crushing it, but also about ourselves, right, we can either do the like blame or shame thing. And I know, shame slaying is like such a heartbeat of your brand. And like OG motivator for living brave to even come into existence. And I love that that has been such a consistent pillar that you have not only returned to but I feel like it’s like a spiral. It’s like a spiral upward in the evolution of the application of this thing of like, really slaying shame, and taking radical responsibility for any ways in which we try to push away the things that we want, because we don’t feel worthy of them. I think it’s like, there’s no more important conversation to be having in the leadership space than that.

Shoshanna
Yeah, absolutely. No, the premise has always been like, your deepest shame is the source of your greatest power. The things that you hide from the world are really once you own and claim them. And, you know, you can transcend them. And they actually are the things that make you most lovable that make you most magnetic. And the stories that we have about ourselves about other people, like there’s so heavy, you know, and shame and resentment and grudges, any of these things that we’re holding, they’re so heavy, like, these are the things it’s not our emotions, like the fact that we’re sad and we fear and we have disappointing days like this isn’t what blocks or manifestations. It’s like our energy around our acceptance of it, how much it’s a shadowy part of ourselves that we hide and keep in the dark, like how much of our humaneness do we hide and I think a lot of people are in such heavy addictive patterns, you know of shame of self sabotage, not realizing that there’s a huge shadow piece to this, like these are repetitive, like really safe, comfortable. Now, addictive patterns of being like, anything that we hold in the darkness and anything that we shame ourselves for anything we’re unwilling to look at, is weighing us down, you know, has power over us. And so whenever someone’s like, whenever I feel now activated or triggered by something, and like, oh, there’s something for me here, because if something just wasn’t for me, it would be like, Oh, not for me. Not like that, like, oh my gosh, do you think you are? And so when someone’s like, Who do you think you are? And they tell you, it’s like, Oh, you just gave me your shadow self on a silver platter. Like you just told me what you were afraid of. Embodying or which you’re like, shameful of or resentful of, like, it’s so easy to see these big reactive things that just are shadows on a silver platter. And so that you have that journey of like, shame, saying, you know, and the journey of, of really being embodied in our own mentorship is taking our message. And then seeing like, How can I live this and every single day like embracing the full spectrum of humanity, which is not always easy. It’s like, I didn’t sign up for easy. I signed up for aliveness. And part of that is like, it’s not always easy. And there’s some career paths where it’s like, maybe it just gets easier. And I feel like the path of mentorship is like, it’s hard. Like you, you walk yourself through things so that you may tell the story, because no one wants to work with someone who it’s like, yeah, you know, it was kind of hard in the beginning. And then I just became a mentor. And it was really easy forever and ever. It’s like, what kind of book are you going to write about that, like, if you want to be a living legend, it’s like you walk yourself through things, and you reach higher and higher and higher levels.

Cait
Yes. And new things emerge and arise. And this is one thing that I think and I’d love to get into this a little that I think is just so cool and beautiful about the evolution of you as a woman, your brand your business in the last year, you know, it’s like the all of the magic and like the feminine strategy, sales, storytelling, all of those like Juicy, juicy millions and zillions of programs that are just so rich and so valuable. One thing I’ve seen you embrace this year, is really this, like multi dimensionality of woman and how, who we are first and foremost, you know, ripples out and like the business, the wealth, all of that is kind of like the fun and juicy like afterthought. It’s the cherry on top, you’re literally wearing a cherry sweater right now, which I love. But it’s like, that’s the fun, juicy byproduct, but it’s actually so much of an Inner Inner Game. And so I’d love to talk about like, mentorship and our own, you know, like thought leadership as this living, breathing, evolutionary process. And like the programs that we write, in some ways get to be like our external journal into the world of like, what we are bringing through channeling, you know, and like birthing into existence.

Unknown Speaker
Oh, my gosh, Cait, this has been my journey this year. Like my I launched a program at the end of last year, which was a mastermind I called to expand, because what I found was my own journey was being representative, my clients, like people are coming to me saying, you know, the old thing works, and I love what I’ve built, but like, I want to, I want to go bigger, like I have this other thing that’s exciting. I have this other dimension to myself, I want to bring to the table. And a lot of people were also getting that confused with I want to tear it all to the ground and pivot. And I kept saying it’s not a pivot, it’s not a needing to tear it all down. It’s an expansion. It’s a refinement, it’s a building upon what was and I hope, like, my path to scaling has been how can I bring more of myself to the table, like, I’m exploring this dimension of my growth, I’m going to embody, I’m going to feel it, I’m gonna lead from a space of here’s exactly who I am and what I know, not trying to be something I’m not but like, I’ve learned these things, and I want to share them with you, you know, my first wealth program, I wasn’t a millionaire yet. I was just like, Whoa, I hit a certain financial level, and it didn’t feel how I thought it would feel, you know, and I want to, like bring to the table what I have, you know, what I’ve learned from this process in this journey and what I’ve learned in my experience as a financial writer, and I created this program that was really my own creative offering. And I felt like my product suite has just grown as an extension of my own personal journey.

Unknown Speaker
And yes, I’ve come back to some of the same programs and refine them and some of them don’t even look the same, you know, year after year, and I think I’ve just come to terms with there might be a point in my career where I’m like, This is it. This is the program these are the programs but as of now I’m like refining what was I’m building new offers and I think a lot of people feel like it’s the time that stressful it’s a launching that stressful what for me, it’s so empty and it feels like going to work when I’m like launching the same thing talking about the same thing. And I see so many people build multi seven figure businesses plus, and they’re like I ran out of things to say I’m tired of doing Same thing and like, for me, and like you couldn’t pay me enough of what I get through sharing about what I’m on the edge of, and I become more deeply embodied and initiated in my work. Like when I teach my programs and that expansion, like I get to, like, it’s not only can I do this, because my audience knows me as as passing, it’s creating a brand where that’s my strategy is that I’m evolving and that my community is like, Who is she going to be next? And what is happening next, and I want to grow with you.

Shoshanna
And so we have a lot of people continuing on rather than Am I allowed and being employed by a past identity, being a bypass brand, I did a whole class on this, because there’s so much, it’s hard is so much grief, you, you might lose people in your life, who you realize you didn’t have a deep, deep friendship, whether they were only okay with you being a certain version of yourself. And this year, I’ve explored the edges of my identity, like, wild, you know, it’s like, the blonde hair and the nails and like the eyelashes and all that, like, that’s just scratching the surface and like, what do I feel like, I would never do that. And let me go do it, because of who I am, is below all of that. Like, I owe it to myself to explore the edges of my identity to explore my interests and my passions and do that publicly. And there are people who are here and, and for that, and part of my friendship evolution this year, which has been huge, like community evolution. And my own business is like, I desire to create spaces in my life, and in my community, where you can know without a shadow of a doubt, that you are accepted and loved and every new expression of yourself because I see you beyond, you know, the unapologetic expression like your soul. And I think we all yearn for that, you know, to just be loved and accepted for who we are knowing that you can, you know, drive whatever color or you want to drive, you can talk about whatever you want to talk about online, you can, you know, take a month or a year off, and you can change careers and we’re still here and we still love you. And that’s like true connection, which has been the core of living Brave is like, true connection. Like when we get to the deepest truth of your soul. Like that’s the first time I really met myself and I met people like I felt hugs for the first time, like talking about genital herpes, but that was more than that. It was like, Oh, these things I thought if the world ever found out about me, like I’d be rejected and instead I’m meeting love and so I feel that I learned this year I was subconsciously taking on old identities because what if I really explored like the totality of who I was when I lose people and I think you’ll only ever lose things that weren’t meant for you and everything that’s meant for you will come back a new form a new shape, if you give it some time.

Cait
100% And it’s like that is a cost or that is a like that fear that worst case scenario and I know you know like this part of my story as well like we have to be willing to let the worst thing happen whether that is relationships falling away or judgment from people whose whose perception we really value to you know, we have to be willing to walk through that risk we have to be willing to walk through that fire because and I love how you say said this like I owe it to myself to be the fullness of who I am and to let that evolution be happening in lifetime and not need to show up today as this like boxed in perfect representative of who I was yesterday but as the living breathing evolution in motion of who I am and I feel like that as a template for what it means to be a thought leader for what it means to mentor and like guide and lead yourself first but also be a space holder in a way paper for other women is so radical and is so radical in the best way and it’s so important because it highlights like you know I think and I’m sure you’ve seen this as well but I think a lot of things for really powerful women once we start building a big brand once we start gaining a lot of momentum it’s like oh I’m known for XYZ thing or like I can talk about or this like story we tell ourselves of like oh my people love me for my you know quantum world content or my storytelling content like surely I can’t create a program on love or shortly you know goofy old shows can’t just go out and buy Louis Vuitton and have these fucking dope as nails all the sudden like surely I can’t be XYZ thing and I feel like it’s such a radical and important line in the sand to be like No, actually I can and I can be someone completely new tomorrow.

Shoshanna
Absolutely. And it’s humbling to see like, Oh, I did so much work on your more than your mind and your body like you are the unborn undying self and then I just assumed all these personalities like I would never make this much I would never buy luxury things, I would never do that. Like, I have this identity of like this hippie backpacker. And when I was growing my business, I had a certain identity of what kind of coach I was. And I’m like, this is just all a box. And I’m here to help people break out of the box. And like he’s like, I owe it to myself to expand and just explore who I desire to be. Because I know who I am beneath everything. And I think, you know, my heartbreak journey, which I had a call of you the day after,

Cait
I remember that I’ll never forget that You almost canceled. And I’m like, this call because this is the most important time.

Shoshanna
Yeah.And I wrote that little sticky note, because you’ve shared with me that during a really hard time for you, someone had shared, like, what is the most loving thing you can do for myself today. And I’ve shared that with my own clients. And I had a sticky note this like pink sticky note on the same desk. And that for me, it was just so impactful to have you by my side during those times. Because gosh, like that was that was really brutal. But what it did, like all of my knees on the earth moments, like oh my gosh, like where were so many people have, they’re just like their breakthroughs, honestly, because they’re met in full surrender, they’re met. And here’s how I thought my life was going to be who I thought I was. I’m at my wit’s end, and I’m on my knees. And I’m like, praying for a sign. And you told me on that call to like shows. I know, you probably don’t want to hear this. But like, your this is, you said something like this is so on brand, like you’re gonna be teaching.

Cait
Yes, well, no, do you know? Yes, I totally did say that. And I remember because we got on the call, and you burst into tears. And you’re like, Oh, my God, my face. And I was like, What are you talking about your life, I just look like crying. And I’m like, You are crying. Like you’ve been crying. But it was like, You’re what I meant when I said that. And it’s like, coming up in this conversation so beautifully is like, you are somebody who walks with women into these portals into these moments into these like pivotal, like knees on the ground moments and like, is with them and sits beside them and says like, yes, you’re in it. And this is not the end of your story. And it’s like it is on brand for you to be going through that. And we can like conceptualize this right, we can know about it, we can have it written up in like our brand, vocab, PDF or whatever. But to actually be in that moment of our own trajectory and timeline. It’s like, you know, it’s sort of like the equivalent, like I felt in some ways, like I was just like sitting with you, like holding back your hair, rubbing your back on the bathroom floor as you were having your like puke into the toilet moment. And it’s like, you know, mentorship gets to be so many different things. And it’s like, also that humbling in the knowing of like, I can do that for you. Because I also like have those moments and I feel like that like humanizing that you’re talking about. It’s just like this, this important recognition that these are all just like portals and thresholds that we all go through and our capacity to like, be okay and surrender to when they arise for us and to let our you know, proverbial hair be held and backs be rubbed as we have those moments. It’s like so, so important.

Shoshanna
That was the biggest breakthrough for me that’s changed my life moving through that heartbreak was the first time that my community my mission, my work held me to a high standard, it was like, Yes, we go through things in life and, and we want to move through them with grace. But when I had that context of how am I going to tell this story? How am I actively telling the story? Yes, no, like, this is gonna this is like my living legend. Like, yeah, I want to be proud of this. I want to make my clients proud. Does it mean like for a lot of people, I think it’s like, how do I show up in hard times, and for me, it was like, this is the most important time for me to show up because people want a leader who can lead us when we need to be led. We don’t need to be led, you know, when everything’s going great. It’s like totally when I can show up in my in my tears and actually share like what I’m on the edge of when I can, you know, I felt like my work reenergized me like I didn’t bury myself in my work or get lost in my work. In fact, I started working a bit less I took Mondays and Fridays off it went to Hawaii but I was still showing up and every time I had a call it like reminded me of my power. And so my work like carried me through that period and something that I think set me up for this expansion of identity expansion of brand expansion of self and you know, I I was single for seven months, a lot of that alone. I started dating again, walked myself through a lot of that I knew I was walking myself through a lot of that because I’ll be teaching it and falling back in love and this whole year you know, it’ll be a year with my partner. We just moved in together, like, I know that a huge part of that work was through what you said of like, I owe it to myself to explore my identity, it was a connecting to a deeper part of self that happens when everything falls away. And you hear that voice.

Unknown Speaker
And I remember I would talk to myself, I’d be like, you know, what’s the most loving thing you can do for yourself today? But it was also like, Hey, girl, like, you know, what do you mean? Like we’ve I would start I was like talking to myself, it was like building this really solid relationship with myself again, with love and with, like, such self intimacy, and I think sometimes in relationship and work and life, we’re seeking so many things, you know, that I was seeking in my relationship and realizing like when it all fell away, where was I not really, really intimate with myself and truthful with myself and like, building this relationship, like, I’ve got you, I love you, I see you and I will never abandon you. Which means if you have a desire, even if it makes no freaking sense, like however you want to express yourself, whoever you want to be, like, you will not accept love less than what you give yourself and acceptance for less than your own level of self acceptance. So if I accept myself and all of my different evolutions, and all of my different shades, like I am willing to let go of people and places and things and identities that don’t offer me the same level of acceptance and love that I offer myself. So that was a huge kind of rebuilding that foundation.

Cait
It’s so powerful oof, chills, I love that so much. And the application to that is just in every direction, it’s in relationships, it’s in you know, personal relationships, business relationships, like just the the level I mean, I think about how that plays out in like romantic relationships and the way that we are able to be with our partners and like, their fullness of range and expression. It’s like if we are just like constantly on this trigger fest, and like pointing the finger out, you know, where’s the mirror of like, what we’re not able to hold on ourselves. So there’s just so many good things so many juicy nuggets in like every single direction. I literally feel like this episode could be three hours so I am just like looking at the clock here. One thing that I want to I really want to ask you to share with us is like what is on you know, knowing that you shows are just this like, you know, evolutionary artist in motion in progress. There’s always something new always something fresh, always something up, you just celebrated your birthday. You just moved in with your partner. I’m curious at this moment in time, November 22 2022 1122 22. What is on your edge right now? Like what are you feeling into? What are you be dazzled by? What are you dancing with? Like, what is your evolutionary edge right now as leader as woman?

Shoshanna
Oh my gosh. First of all, you’re like, at your bring me to tears again. So we’ve talked a lot about evolution and expansion. And you know, I started this back in that shame, slaying and personal growth. And then I realized that a lot of the same things that are holding people back in their own personal evolution journey is the same stuff that holds us back in business and doing business coaching and helping people with personal brands. And I love I love this. I love it so much. I love that really you learn that 95% of it is a leadership game and doing leadership work. And I feel that one of the most tender parts of my journey has really been Oh, like romance and love and which all stems from our relationship with self right. And so I’ve started to share more. And I’ve shared about my heartbreak journey, but really totally Cait like, completely revolutionising over the past 18 months looking at like, attachment looking at feminine masculine energetics, either around the word feminine leadership. And I think I knew like 20% of what that actually meant. And I think a lot of people are doing that. It’s like feminine leadership does not just mean you don’t do sales calls and like you don’t have a sales page or whatever. Like you can do sales, whatever you want. It’s the energy behind your strategy anyway, that, you know, really matters. You know, but like, oh, like really doing that deep work. And for me, I think the whole context is like, has always been coming back to write our own inner personal power. And so how that is applied. I think the way I teach it is always going to evolve. But for me, I’ve hit new levels of really understanding that I am actively living the stories when I’m on the edge of right now. It’s like Yeah, just even sharing maybe this will be helpful for someone just to know like when you look at our businesses and what we’ve created, like behind the scenes, you know, I had my whole team, basically, I’m going through a whole team refresh, like, I had a conscious uncoupling of two employees.

Unknown Speaker
And, you know, I went through, like, put out the job application, I had this qualified applicant, we had a cultural interview, and it wasn’t a fit, and I literally cried, I like cried because I was like, Oh, my gosh, you know, I had a moment of like, what is gonna happen next. And I realized, like, 30 minutes later in the car, I was like, I am living a legend in my brand, like, in a year, I’m going to teach, just sorry about when everyone left and we put the application out. And there was one person who, who applied and ended up really not being good fit. And I cried, you know, and in the car, I realize I’m about to find the people who are going to take us to the next level. And like this is I’m not sharing, I think it’s important. Like, I’m not sharing something that happened last year, like this is like last week. So currently, like that’s what I’m going through.

Unknown Speaker
And like, I am like setting myself up for a big, big expansion. But in terms of like, what I’m on the edge of in my life. And what I’m bringing to my business is a lot of why it was weaved into the conversation day like the inner game, like empowering our own energetics, like some edgy conversations around empowering our masculine or feminine and how we really heal our relationships. Because this is something that I see. I had a hard time prioritizing, and I see a lot of people struggling, it’s like you build the business, you hit the milestones on paper, but behind the scenes, if your closest relationships in your life are struggling, what the heck is it worth Oh, totally, it’s not worth it, I feel happier. And more like in love with myself, and with my partner and with my friends and I’ve ever felt and I’m still growing the business, but all of these things like rejuvenate me. And it’s always gonna feel like a work life balance. If they feel like work, if my work no longer feels like work and my relationships, like when you said like that judgment and needing your partner to be something it’s like, I am in complete, like surrender. And in my relationship, I’m like, you can be exactly who you are. And like I’m exactly who I am. And I used to be the one like taking the reins, taking control, just letting my inner little girl and, you know, all of the patterns I got for my family, like dictate my relationship and it’s like I have literally heal generational patterns of relating and created like so much peace in my life, I can not hold back anymore. So I look forward to bringing more of have that conversation to the table. It’s been like, almost two years in the making, like deep self study and deep study and getting myself in rooms as we always do. But I really first see that being a new expansion. And again, like, if I can teach story sales, like relationship business, like everything, like you can do it, you know, you can have multiple dozen projects, you get to do it.

Cait
So juicy Shosh, oh my god, I love this. And I love how like permission giving in the most, like energizing and powerful way possible. This is like you don’t need to have like a PhD and like interpersonal relations or whatever to like Teach relations, like you need to be a student first and foremost, like deeply of what is happening within you, you need to be devoted, like a devotee of that own evolutionary process. And you need to be brave enough to speak about it and share about it and say, Hey, this is what’s real. This is what’s true. Come on this exploration with me. I think this is so powerful, and frankly, such a new and necessary frame for what it means to be a real like cutting edge leader and a mentor in this space. So I love this so much. And I feel like there’s so many like juicy like curtain pullback moments in this to our upcoming share about what it means to be a mentor. What mentorship actually is, do you want to say anything about that and what we’ve got covered?

Shoshanna
I’m super excited because I feel like we’ve really are doubled trouble, like how I would feel when I would show up to our calls is like, I have a list of all the things you’re going to move through and then be like, me, me, me, me, me, me. So I’m excited like for our, our minds, our hearts, our spirits to come together like how we just riff together And I really see you know, the the women that we attract humans we attract into our world, they feel like understand holistic growth. Yes. And you having all of your life experience and all the different kinds of like, you have allow and you have your motherhood program, you have all these different kinds of programs along with your like, Baby Got Back end and like systems and strategy and I’ve got like, all of my work when I’m like, Oh, here’s that more feminine strategy and how you bring story into it and sales, but also, you know, these these different programs on like, my new symbiosis firm up feminine masculine energetic from the inner game, like how we really see like your business and your leadership growing in the context of your whole life. And that’s like the juice that I got from our mentorship space. And that happens behind the scenes in my spaces, it’s like, you’re seen, like, let’s look at every dimension of you. And like, I’m gonna bring my whole life experience my work with hundreds of 1000s of clients and like, you do the same. And then we come together with our deep knowing of each other, and get to like, riff off of that and help people like, really step into their next expansion. Like, that’s what I see. It’s like, what’s their next evolution and just fly into the end of the year, and it’s through the bank.

Cait
So good job, and you know, is that and it’s such a rare space to number one, like be in the room with two women who yes, like vastly different life experiences, but like this also this like deep appreciation for and real commonality of this, like whole woman approach. But like two women who also like know each other really well in our relationship over 18 months, and to be able to like, you know, riff off of each other, but then like, deeply attuned to what is happening, what is present in the room. And I’m like, so reminded in this moment, you know, in our conversation today, how you shared and it’s so beautiful, I love these moments were like something that I said, but I’m sure you have this with your clients as well. But like something that I said, that landed with you that I would never have known that that one sticky note moment was like pivotal for you, and that you share that with your clients now, but like that, it just reminds me the potency of sometimes like one thing that lands in a conversation like one phrase that we say one tidbit that we offer, one reflection, we mirror back like truly has the potential to change the trajectory of somebody’s life and experience and so to like, be in the room with both of us holding space for these incredible humans who are going to step inside of this experience together with us. It’s just so exciting.

Shoshanna
Ah, you know, as you say that too. I know that you’ve had multiple mentors, and I’ve worked with like, for me, honestly, there’s no people like how did you get to where you are, and like the people I’ve learned from my life experience my embodiment, and I’ve gotten in every single room, I’m like, I admire what you’ve built. I want to get behind the scenes, let’s do it. What I think is like when people just kind of hop, hop, hop hop, like, yes, I’ve had different mentors, while we’re working together, or like, you know, currently, I’m like, Oh, I’m in a few different containers, but I really value and going deep with someone rather than sample sample sample. And so to be able to go deep, and also to learn from different people and get different viewpoints, especially people who trust you to trust yourself. Like, I feel like our coaching is not like, here’s the one way to do it. And vow not really confusing when people are like, Oh, I don’t want to learn from two people at once. Because, you know, you’re telling me this, and then you’re telling me this? Well, when it’s presented as this is the only way this is the only way, then it is kind of tricky to have two different mentors at once. But to have two different approaches, I think can get confusing when they’re in different spaces. Like I’ve still done it. And it still works if you have self sovereignty, but it can be like you go to this phase, especially when you’re just talking about problems. It’s like I talk about my problem here. Then I talked about my problem here. And it’s like talk about the problems in one space. But to have still like one space, but two different viewpoints where you know, that they’re not going to be like we come from a similar school of thought like you have had such an impact on me and my mentorship and although we have different things you bring to the table, and I’ve worked with so many people and so of you and it’s like there’s a very there’s an underlying thread where you’re not worried that it’s like this is like completely new information. It’s like we have we’re in the same lineage.

Cait
Yes. And it’s like we get to bring it’s like an enriching and as I think what you’re highlighting is like mentorship that is truly about like, what is real, what is alive, what is present for you and one thing that you can like take to the bank with either of us in your corner and with both of us in your corner certainly is like we are here to support what is like the most emergent thing for you not give you a script and say, here’s how you treat your condition or something like that. It’s really about like pulling out what is already within you as opposed to stuffing seeing you as an empty vessel that needs to be stuffed with our magic.

Cait
Yes, absolutely. And, you know, any, like different perspective is not a confusing perspective. IOh my gosh, I’m so excited.

Cait
I’m so excited to Okay, so if you are listening to this and you’re like, wait, holy hotcakes, you guys are doing something together the cats out of the bag. Yes, we are. You can DM either one of us for more info we’re going to be sharing on both of our socials upcoming. So go to chaussures Insta or mine, come say hello, you can DM us to get really details. And we are so excited to leave this for you guys.

Shoshanna
I cannot wait like I would take the program

Cait
I know I’m like I can’t even wait to watch the replays it’s gonna be so juicy Shosh. I love you so much. You’re incredible. This was amazing. I’m sure everyone who’s listening to this already follows you. But where can we get more of you more living brave and more just connected to that heartbeat of what is evolving, and hopefully more of this cherry sweater.

Unknown Speaker
I know you know I’m gonna be wearing this all the time. Cherries and strawberries. Well I obviously I hang out on Instagram a lot. It’s at Shana underscore Raven, but I also am about to have Cait on my podcast. And I think we’ve already done a podcast episode on living brave. You’ve done. You’ve been on mine. I’ve been on yours. It’s our second batch, which is so good. Oh my gosh, that’s so fun. But I have the living brave podcast and I’m gonna have Cait as a guest soon. So you can hear part two and more of me being able to ask her all the juicy questions.

Cait
So good shows. Thank you for being here. Thank you for being you and for everybody listening. Thank you so much for being here. It’s so fun to pop back on to the podcast while she is in her evolutionary process. I can’t wait to share more with you guys soon. But like I said DM Shosh or myself for details about what we have cooking up for you because we are so excited to share it shows I love you. Thank you for being here. Love you. Thank you for listening. Thank you, Cait.